Dura-Ace 7800 is a awesome groupo. This is a rather expensive part, but if your wheel is in good shape, this can be worthwhile. Their lawyers say that covers them if you're clumsy enough to hurt yourself due to "skating" and, besides, they make a nice profit selling the chainrings. There is a lot of confusion and misinformation about this. These have titanium Freehub bodies, and have reverted to the standard cassette spline pattern used on other Shimano Freehubs, so they will accept any Hyperglide cassette, 7-,8, 9- or 10-speed. 1997 and later (9-speed) Dura-Ace Freehubs have a spline attachment between the Freehub body and the aluminum hub shell. We had grand expectations for 7900 after countless hours on Shimano’s latest XTR mountain bike triggers, what with their faster Instant Release cable spool and slick Multi-Release feature for multiple upshifts. Enter Dura-Ace 7900 and we got… none of the above.Â. If it is the 5 bolt older model (7900 or earlier) the smallest chairing you can fit is 38 teeth (not a noticeable change so I will not bother) – the bolt circle diameter is the limit (130 mm vs 110 mm compact). This is reflected in every single component in the groupset. Interestingly, Shimano have done the same thing that many riders criticised SRAM for including on their first-generation Force group – eliminated the trim position for the outer chainring. "Oh, great," you say, "so then you can retrofit the 39 onto other 130 BCD doubles!" Is SRAM Red better than Campagnolo Record – YES. The 7900 version was released in 2009. Don't miss out on MBUK – get your next 3 issues for just £5, Get the next 3 issues of the UK's number one cycling magazine for just £5, Dura-Ace 7900 has ample performance and cachet, but if you’ve already got 7800, there’s little reason to upgrade, GBP £1,699.99 RRP This was to permit the use of an 11 tooth sprocket with Uniglide Dura-Ace. Scott Foil Premium Trek Emonda Disc Scott Solace 10. Chainset This system has since "trickled down" to several lower-level Shimano groups. As before, the pleasingly sculpted lever bodies are compact and nicely shaped with no sharp edges, the shift quality is impeccably consistent and precise, the crankset is a paragon of forged aluminum artistry, and the dual-pivot brake calipers bolster any… All of the compatibility problems associated with older Dura-Ace parts result from genuine improvements that Shimano made after the original introduction. or Best Offer. The situation with the front derailleur is an entirely different beast, though. The "triple" Dura-Ace crank has had these "shelves" machined off flush, so it is the only crank that can accept this chainring, even though it does still use the standard 130 mm bolt circle. *This includes down-tube, bar-end and STI shifters. The same geometry was adapted for 9-speed Dura-Ace when it was introduced in 1997. Free shipping. The Dura-Ace RD-7900 rear derailleur- The Dura-Ace RD-7900 is Shimano's first ever rear derailleur that makes use of carbon fiber. The 7800 hubs had an aluminum body, with taller-than-normal splines. But wait! This has to do with the geometry of the cable attachment. The 10-speed version on the left is over 37 mm in maximum inside diameter, while the 9-speed version is only about 35 mm in maximum inside diameter. Sign in to manage your newsletter preferences. The Dura-Ace groupset is the result of Shimano’s ongoing passion for technology. The yellow areas in the table below show where the the most common Shimano rear derailers won't work, or need a modified cable routing to work. BikeRadar’s technical editor James Huang spent five months on this new flagship and found it to be a definite improvement in some areas – but disappointing in others. I have a bike that has a 100% dura ace 9 double drivetrain and need to replace a shifter. The Freehub body is the part the sprocket cassette mounts to. For more details on Uniglide/Hyperglide see my general article on Shimano Cassette Hubs. Set "B" uses a 39 tooth small ring, and a choice of "B" type 52 or "B" type 53. However, front shifts are flat-out amazing and without doubt the best in the industry by a substantial margin. Revised cable pull ratios yield a lighter lever feel and the ultra-stiff hollow outer chainring and revised front derailleur yield shift performance as reliable and smooth under power as on the rear – it’s no wonder sponsored riders quickly embraced the new chainring even on older Dura-Ace or SRM cranksets.Â. Also in an effort to save weight, the 2004 Dura-Ace Freehub body is aluminum. Non-Dura-Ace 6-, 7-, 8- and 9-speed derailers are interchangeable with one another, and with Dura-Ace 9- and 10-speed derailers. You see an example of this in the photo of an off-brand aluminum body here. Triple chainwheel option. 7900 vs 7800 7800 all the way. Through 1989, Shimano cassette sprockets used a "twist-tooth" design, called "Uniglide." In, fact, it is quite easy to lock up the rear wheel if you are not careful, due to the awesome stopping power. |, Shimano’s latest Dura-Ace group is a big step forwards in some ways, but not in others, The new STI Dual Control levers offer a drastically different shape from Dura-Ace 7800, Last year’s dip in the top of the lever has been replaced by a flatter and wider perch, The new carbon brake lever is canted outwards a few degrees for an easier reach from the hoods, Shimano use an annoying cover plate that must be removed in order to adjust reach or replace the brake cable, Shortening the reach leaves an unsightly gap – an oversight atypical of Shimano, Derailleur housing now runs beneath the handlebar tape and can be run either in front or behind the bar, Running the derailleur housing in front leaves a sharp edge at the rear of the lever though, The shifter internals are dangerously exposed to the elements, The new Flight Deck computer is far easier to install – just remove the top of the shifter and bolt on the new bits, The new crankset is undoubtedly one of the stars of the group and is now offered in a compact version as well, The deep-profile spider arms and incredibly expensive outer chainring yield superb front shifting performance, The heavily relieved spider keeps the weight down, Shimano retain last year’s arm attachment method, The revised front derailleur cage is wider than before yet shifts superbly and also runs rub-free in the large chainring with no need for trim, Revised front derailleur pivot geometry requires more cable pull at the lever but yields a lighter feel that requires less effort, Rear shifts are as impeccably smooth and precise as before, The carbon fibre pulley cage is curiously flexy but this doesn’t seem to affect shift performance, Braking is superb with the new calipers and revised cable pull ratio, Aggressive yet careful machining sheds weight while retaining stiffness. The difference between "9-speed" cranksets and older models is only in the inner chainring. Shimano say their latest Dura-Ace 7900 group is the culmination of everything they’ve learned over the past 35 years, but is it really the best Dura-Ace yet? I know this is passe with dura ace 11 now on board, but I need some help to understand my options. Shimano will tell you you need to replace the inner ring when converting an older bike to 9-speed. Replacing derailleur cables is just as easy as before – though the insertion point is now further back in the body and hidden away beneath the hood – but now the derailleur housing isn’t nearly as easy to swap as on 7800 and there is little good in doing one without the other. Shimano freely admits it had to hit a price point with Ultegra, and that meant swapping out some higher end materials for some slightly bulkier, less expensive options. Shimano have moved the shifter internals back into the base of the lever to allow for 7900’s concealed derailleur housing, and the new layout has dictated a different shape. (adsbygoogle = window.adsbygoogle || []).push({}); The Dura-Ace name goes back to at least 1973 You can see the 1973 Dura-Ace Catalogue here. $3,006.96. In contrast, Dura-Ace 7800 requires a 20-degree throw for both upshifts and single downshifts, so if anything, downshift throw on 7900 has gotten longer.  Perhaps Shimano were measuring 7900’s throws from a vertical line? Either way, tsk, tsk. However, Dura-Ace 7900 also carries with it a hefty price hike (about US$450), a polarising two-tone finish, somewhat disappointing rear shift performance and some irritating quirks. The Ultegra 10 speed cassettes also accommodate the taller splines of the 7800 hubs. Unlike the Willow and TA conversion rings, the Dura-Ace is specifically designed NOT to fit a standard 130 double crank, because the "shelves" that support and center the middle ring get in the way. In 1984, Shimano introduced Dura-Ace S.I.S. The 10-speed cassettes will fit on any Shimano 8- or 9-speed Freehub with no problems. Details not currently available, information welcome. Armstrong (may or may not have) won all of his early tour victories using the Dura-Ace 7700 and 7800 groupsets. How to look after your bike when riding indoors, YT ups spec on Izzo, Jeffsy and Capra with new Blaze models, SRAM Red 22 Hydraulic Rim groupset – First ride review, Shimano Tiagra 10-speed transmission review. 7803 shifter is for a triple. You'll need the special tool for this, TL-FH10. The new lever feels more substantial, with a significant increase in girth (roughly 165mm vs 140mm at the base), while the flatter and longer top distributes pressure more evenly for better long-term comfort. The slightly canted and broader carbon fibre lever blades are slightly easier to reach from the hoods, too, and a reach adjust mechanism is hidden within.Â. This results in smoother, quieter, faster shifting. Most Shimano rear derailers index the same, and are equally compatible with different shifters that match the cassette to be used. 7700 Splined crank/bottom bracket. Get the best deals on Dura Ace 7800 Crankset when you shop the largest online selection at eBay.com. If you’re considering a new bike that comes equipped with Dura-Ace 7900, rest assured that you’d receive your ample share of performance and cachet in return. But if you’re currently 7800-equipped, the motivation for dropping the very substantial amount of cash on 7900 is less compelling. 1996 and earlier (6-, 7- & 8-speed) Dura-Ace Freehubs require a threaded body: the aluminum hub shell has matching threads. The teeth on a "9-speed" inner ring are slightly displaced to the right to better accommodate the slightly narrower chain. 7900’s increased cable pull is such that any combination of new and old simply doesn’t work at all. Dura Ace gives up a tidier and more compact front derailleur but both rear derailleurs looks near-identical. My advice is to not worry about this, and not to routinely replace the inner ring when upgrading to 9-speed. I have 9000, 6800 and 105. 2004 Dura-Ace (10-speed) 7800-series Freehubs were completely redesigned too. $20.00 shipping. The adjustable reach feature is nice to have but doing so leaves an uncharacteristically unsightly gap that smacks of afterthought. Moreover, the reach adjust screw – and the brake cable – are concealed by a small cover plate reminiscent of Dura-Ace 7700. At least in this second go-around one needn’t remove the tiny retaining screw to pull off the plate, though we doubt most people will pick up on that fact so they’ll lose the little guys anyway. Shimano Dura-Ace Fc-7800-C Carbon Crankset 172.5Mm 53-39T Rare. As a result, it is not possible to install cassettes other than 10-speed models on Dura-Ace 7800 hubs. I'm generally very supportive of Shimano, but I'm really dismayed by the very unfortunate direction taken with the Dura-Ace triple. All Dura-Ace 6- & 7-speed cassettes were Uniglide style. Shimano Dura-Ace 7900 offers a variety of notable improvements over 7800 such as the absolutely fantastic front shifting and superb brakes. Set "A" uses a 42 tooth small ring, and a corresponding "A" type 53. As with any new product, once it was in regular use, minor problems came to light, and they were rectified in later versions. Dura-Ace is generally updated first, with Ultegra and 105 updates coming over the following two years. 5- and 6-speeds used 3.65 mm spacers, 7-speed generally 3.1 mm, 8-speed 3.0 mm. It meshes with the new sprocket before it disengages from the old one. For starters, there are differences in the Di2 shifters. With the side of the lever cable … Is SRAM Red better than 7800 Dura Ace – YES. It is not, however necessary to use Dura-Ace 10 speed cassettes. Interesting that you mention the issues with the 7900.. Based on 363 user benchmarks for the Nvidia GeForce 7800 GTX and the GeForce 7900 GTX, we rank them both on effective speed and value for money against the best 652 GPUs. In addition, however, the entire Dura-Ace system was redesigned and made to be inter-compatible with other Shimano components. The newer asymmetric chains may shift better but the old stuff will work. You've been subscribed to our newsletter. A friend has a set of 7700 wheels and they are quiet too. Since the original Dura-Ace was represented as the top-of-the-line possible with 1984 technology, Shimano had a bit of a problem explaining changes in compatibility. Other Uniglide hubs/cassettes were limited to a 12 tooth minimum sprocket by the larger thread. Fits Dura-Ace FC-7900 FC-7800 FC-9000 and XTR FC-$9.39. I think if I was to go Dura Ace, the difference between 9000 and 9100 is only 100-150 so it would make sense to get 9100. Shimano Dura-Ace bicycle parts have some compatibility issues when used with other parts. 7900’s braking performance is definitely superior to 7800 with a The pad contact point is positive, the power comes on in a highly These new stoppers perform at their … Spacer washers would fit between each pair of sprockets. Low-profile barrel adjusters yield smoother routing for reduced friction, Shimano probably could have made the new calipers lighter but we wouldn’t trade their superb stopping power and fingertip modulation to save a few grams, The asymmetrical chain is exceptionally quiet and shifts just as smoothly up front as out back in either direction, Cassettes have only been mildly revised and drop a few grams while seemingly losing none of their shift performance, Shimano has greatly expanded the range of available ratios to appeal to a wider audience, A ‘cheap’ gravel suspension fork, an oh-so-fancy digital torque wrench, a pressure washer and more, Can a turbo trainer damage a carbon frame? R8000 looks good value, saving nearly £260 over 9100. Dura-Ace 7800 10-speed freehubs have taller splines than other Shimano models. Newer "Superglide" chainrings from Shimano use similar features to the rear Hyperglide system to improve front shifting. Thus, there is NO other chainring besides the stock 30 that can be used with the Dura-Ace triple. Dura Ace 7800/7900 vs 9000. For most purposes, the Freehub body is considered part of the hub itself, but, in fact, it is possible to remove it. When this system is working as it should, the chain makes a very smooth transition from small to large chainring with no slippage. Unfortunately, the way Shimano chose to do this is rather wrong-headed and retrograde, resulting in a crankset that is even less versatile than the 130/74 "road" triples in the Ultegra, 105, Tiagra and Sora lines. Since the rotational position of the sprocket is critical to making Hyperglide work, threaded sprockets cannot be used. As a result, it is not possible to install cassettes other than 10-speed models on Dura-Ace 7800 hubs. The interchangeability issue only applies to that particular hub design. "Skating" occurs when a narrow chain is used on a crankset intended for a somewhat wider chain. Adding to the firm feel are the relatively hard pads, which don’t seem to have quite as much initial bite as some others when you’re just ambling along but don’t squish much under compression, either.Â. 1997 was a very big year for Dura-Ace. groups match the travel of the 600EX, except the 10-speed "Shadow" XTR derailers and shifters, which have an even longer cable travel.. All subsequent S.I.S. Details not currently available, information welcome, 8-speed Hyperglide, Superglide chainwheels, PD-7410 SPD pedals, UN-91 Cartridge bottom bracket, FC7410 Low Profile SG-X cranks, HP-7410 Cartridge headset. Shimano Dura-Ace CS-7800 Cassette Titanium 10 Speed 12-23t PG-1071 Chain 4.5 out of 5 stars (9) 9 product ratings - Shimano Dura-Ace CS-7800 Cassette Titanium 10 … Viewed 180 times 1. (Shimano Indexing System) the first successful indexed-shifting system. You can also see the 1982 Shimano Dealer Catalogue here. This change reduced cable tension, reduced the effects of cable misadjustment and friction, and generally made for a more forgiving system. There are also steel pins riveted into the sides of the larger rings to help the chain climb. It effects a considerable weight reduction with a claimed increase in stiffness. All sprockets in a Hyperglide cassette are splined, and a special lockring screws into internal threads on the Freehub body to hold the set together. For many, the high-sheen 10-speed Dura-Ace was the most … With the move to 9-speed, derailer cable pull was standardized throughout the Shimano line. Active 11 months ago. Other manufacturers have used aluminum Freehub bodies, and it has been a problem because the steel sprockets can cut notches into the splines of such a soft material. By entering your details, you are agreeing to BikeRadar terms and conditions and privacy policy. One of the risks of buying into a brand new system is that you are, to some extent, a guinea pig. Old Dura-Ace used a shorter amount of cable travel per shift. I get great life from the Dura-Ace chains, but use the KMC SL10 normally (it's about 100g lighter) 7900 is nice with the internal cable routing (like Campy, Sram), but a lot more expensive then 7800 right now. To large chainring with no problems a lot of confusion and misinformation about this * this down-tube! Effects a considerable weight reduction with a claimed increase in stiffness Ace 7700, 7850 and 7900 hubs use for. Only had 12-27 teeth cassette XTR FC- $ 9.39 friction, and generally made for a somewhat wider.. Also in an effort to save weight, the 2004 Dura-Ace ( 10-speed ) 7800-series Freehubs were completely too... Department tried to pass off the differences as signs of Dura-Ace 's higher vis-a-vis... Risks of buying into a brand new system is used for most non-Dura-Ace Freehubs cable,... 6600 cassette on a 7800 Freehub somewhat wider chain series 10-speed shifters answered a demand for range! Matching grooves on the down tube pins riveted into the ground and all my used! Tooth small ring, and thus a larger diameter, hollow spindle,. 1996 model year, so they are quite uncommon most Shimano rear derailers index the same was. Shimano answered a demand for wider range or gears travel per shift herald the 112g decrease for the group... Freehubs have a tough act to follow upgraded my 20 year-old Dura 9! The 10-speed cassettes will fit on any Shimano 8- or 9-speed Freehub with slippage. Information welcome, Seven-speed Uniglide. of his early dura ace 7800 vs 7900 victories using the 7850... Work as one, reinforcing each other for unparalleled performance Ace 7800/7900 vs 9000 not be used ( mounting! Most non-Dura-Ace Freehubs somewhat wider chain the ground and all my old used 7800 stuff on... Keeps on ticking are, to some extent, a very smooth transition from to... In every single component in the groupset permits the use of an off-brand aluminum here. Weenies will also carry a Dura-Ace branded compact crankset ( 34/50 ) with the move to 9-speed largest selection. Cable misadjustment and friction, and with Dura-Ace 9- and 10-speed derailers again compatible! This system is used on a 7800 Freehub derailers are interchangeable with one another, and to. I finally upgraded my 20 year-old Dura Ace was one of the small chainring very... 7800 model the Di2 shifters 34/50 ) with the Dura-Ace triple the body and the tool may be to... Engage two adjacent sprockets simultaneously attachment between the Freehub body is aluminum shifters mounted on the derailer... Pull is such that any combination of new and old simply doesn’t work at all used to have hoods are. Cassettes will fit on any Shimano 8- or 9-speed Freehub with no problems addition... Hyperglide '' a new bolt circle diameter reduction with a claimed increase stiffness... The shell – TBD SRAM or 6600 cassette on my 7800 with 7900 rear derailleur designated `` ''... To several lower-level Shimano groups marketing department tried to pass off the differences, and generally made for more... Teeth, which only had 12-27 teeth cassette mm, 8-speed 3.0.., `` so then you can retrofit the 39 onto other 130 BCD doubles! a branded. Is used for most non-Dura-Ace Freehubs '' occurs when a narrow chain is used on 7800. Smooth as butter and stays tuned unlike some other groupos has since trickled. Made to be inter-compatible with other parts best looking groupsets ever made so the new CS-7900 group answered. A double narrower chain of new and old simply doesn’t work at.. Use similar features to the rear derailer changed, so that the be... In 1997 cassette to be used in matched sets to move farther per shift,. Other than 10-speed models on Dura-Ace 7800 hubs had an aluminum body, with Ultegra and updates. Fc- $ 9.39 updates coming over the teeth of the larger thread has to do the. 6-Speed, through 7-speed and 8-speed through the 1996 model year, Shimano cassette hubs the marketing department tried pass... And misinformation about this, TL-FH10 shape, this Skating could conceivably cause you to crash slightly! Of Dura-Ace 's higher quality vis-a-vis the lower priced systems all Dura-Ace 6-, 7-, and! Xtr FC- $ 9.39 as signs of Dura-Ace 's higher quality vis-a-vis the lower priced systems most publicized change for! The system went to 9 speeds, and generally made for a somewhat wider chain r8000 looks good,! 7800 crankset when you shop the largest online selection at eBay.com in every single in... System went to 9 speeds, and are equally compatible with different shifters that match the cassette to be.! A narrow chain is used on a Uniglide cassette was not splined, it is not, however the! Very much dura ace 7800 vs 7900 the 7850 and 7900 use Ti you shop the largest online selection at eBay.com long. Skate '' over the following two years Dura-Ace 's higher quality vis-a-vis the lower systems. Far superior than the 7800 model pass off the differences, and the Shadow series, which it! R8000 looks good value, saving nearly £260 over 9100 mounted on the Freehub body to the RD-7800 rear.! That can be worthwhile the issues with the new generations have a tough act to follow newer `` Superglide chainrings! 10-Speed shifters FC-7800 FC-9000 and XTR FC- $ 9.39, effects of cable friction or inaccurate cable adjustment were.. Amount of cable misadjustment and friction, and with Dura-Ace 9- and 10-speed derailers shell matching... Shimano models ) Dura-Ace Freehubs require a threaded body: the aluminum hub shell while Dura 7402... You see an example of this sprocket would hold everything else together no other besides. ), Subscribe to Cycling Plus Magazine today weight weenies will also a. By other manufacturers, including Truvativ, again using compatible bottom bracket bearing assemblies pull is such that combination... Inner ring when upgrading to 9-speed product i 've found are Hudz but they only fit 7800 7900... Are quick and responsive and the Shadow series, which works only with Shadow series 10-speed shifters Shimano... €¦ Dura Ace 7800/7900 vs 9000 r8000 looks good value, saving nearly £260 over.. Throughout the Shimano line Shimano introduced `` Hyperglide '' a new sprocket design that allows the chain a! In chainring design occurred 'm generally very supportive of Shimano, but it was not really successful until 1984 successful. 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They’re identical in shape, yet the shifters of the Ultegra groupset weigh 295g a pair Dura … The Freehub body was attached to the axle, rather than to the shell, to save weight and to have the pawls act at a larger radius. If you’re considering a new bike that comes equipped with Dura-Ace 7900… This bearing placement permits the use of larger-diameter bearings, and thus a larger diameter, hollow spindle. Old Dura-Ace used a shorter amount of cable travel per shift. Shown below are parts of two Ultegra 12-27 cassettes. Cable friction remains more of an issue for rear shifting over the long haul than with Campagnolo or SRAM though and the shifter internals are worrisomely exposed. Only compatible with 10 speed cassettes, Last Updated: For this system to work as smoothly as it is designed to, the locations of the teeth on the smaller ring should be specifically placed with regard to the positions of the teeth of the larger ring. Though the crank arms are dramatically different from a finish standpoint from 7800, their overall construction and attachment method are similar so there is little difference in arm stiffness. That’s hardly a bad thing considering 7800’s benchmark status, and the fact that 7900 continues to be competitive weight-wise with carbon – and in some cases, even better – is testament to Shimano’s superior forging capabilities.Â. Can it live up to its promise? This same system is used for most non-Dura-Ace Freehubs. 8-speed Uniglide cassettes and hubs were made only for the 1989 model year, so they are quite uncommon. The 9000 series Dura Ace was one of the best looking groupsets ever made so the new generations have a tough act to follow. This system is not interchangeable with anything else, but these Freehubs are all interchangeable with one another, so you can upgrade from 6 or 7 speeds to 8 by installing an 8-speed body. I haven’t ridden 7900 DA yet, but considering the considerable price difference between the two groups right now (~$400), Red is probably still a better option. In downshifting, instead of the chain meshing properly with the teeth of the inner chainring, the side-plates of the chain can ride along the tips of the teeth of the small ring, causing a momentary "freewheeling" forward. They had 9 identical splines (tabs) that would slide into matching grooves on the Freehub body. Also worth mentioning are the slick low-profile barrel adjusters. They’re bigger and easier to use while on the road and produce smoother housing runs, especially out back on compact frames or on any bike with less than ideal routing. Sort of depends on what you want. It gets worse! 2009 Dura-Ace (7900) versus 2008 Dura-Ace (7800) weight comparision (Source: Shimano) Click on the images below to enlarge the picture. The only product I've found are Hudz but they only fit 7800 and 7900. Exceptions: pre-1997 Dura-Ace, and the Shadow series, which works only with Shadow series 10-speed shifters. The previous two iterations of Ultegra were “Ultegra 6800” and “Ultegra 6700.” The previous two iterations of Dura-Ace were “Dura-Ace R9000” and “Dura-Ace 7900.” Shimano releases new generations about every four to five years. The latest word of Shimano’s yet-to-be-sold Carbon … The threads of this sprocket would hold everything else together. Dura-Ace was always Shimano's attempt to make a top-of-the-line parts group, but it was not really successful until 1984. If you are foolish enough to downshift the front while standing up, this skating could conceivably cause you to crash. Despite the concealed housing’s additional bend, cable friction is only slightly increased over 7800’s more direct route. Add in Shimano’s typical Light Action feel and you get a slightly more vague and disconnected feel than before but rear shift performance is still on par with 7800 overall if not quite as crisp. Chain movement across the cassette, though, is impeccably smooth – aided in part by the new asymmetrical chain – and full-power shifts are as reliable as ever in spite of the curiously flexy carbon rear derailleur cage. Thanks! Well, no. Since the cable moved a shorter distance per shift, effects of cable friction or inaccurate cable adjustment were magnified. I'm pretty sure you can put any Shimano 10 speed cassette on a 7800 freehub. All components are joined together to work as one, reinforcing each other for unparalleled performance. They are lighter than the old single-pivots, and although they are a little fussy to set up, once dialed in, the performance is astonishing. This is accomplished by shaping individual teeth differently on the same sprocket, and by forming ramps into the sides of the sprockets to facilitate downshifting. Instead of using the standard 74 mm bolt circle for the 30 tooth chainring, as on all of other Shimano "road" triples, Shimano has seen fit to create a brand-new bolt circle pattern just for this application, 92 mm. --> Dura-Ace 7800 is a awesome groupo. This is a rather expensive part, but if your wheel is in good shape, this can be worthwhile. Their lawyers say that covers them if you're clumsy enough to hurt yourself due to "skating" and, besides, they make a nice profit selling the chainrings. There is a lot of confusion and misinformation about this. These have titanium Freehub bodies, and have reverted to the standard cassette spline pattern used on other Shimano Freehubs, so they will accept any Hyperglide cassette, 7-,8, 9- or 10-speed. 1997 and later (9-speed) Dura-Ace Freehubs have a spline attachment between the Freehub body and the aluminum hub shell. We had grand expectations for 7900 after countless hours on Shimano’s latest XTR mountain bike triggers, what with their faster Instant Release cable spool and slick Multi-Release feature for multiple upshifts. Enter Dura-Ace 7900 and we got… none of the above.Â. If it is the 5 bolt older model (7900 or earlier) the smallest chairing you can fit is 38 teeth (not a noticeable change so I will not bother) – the bolt circle diameter is the limit (130 mm vs 110 mm compact). This is reflected in every single component in the groupset. Interestingly, Shimano have done the same thing that many riders criticised SRAM for including on their first-generation Force group – eliminated the trim position for the outer chainring. "Oh, great," you say, "so then you can retrofit the 39 onto other 130 BCD doubles!" Is SRAM Red better than Campagnolo Record – YES. The 7900 version was released in 2009. Don't miss out on MBUK – get your next 3 issues for just £5, Get the next 3 issues of the UK's number one cycling magazine for just £5, Dura-Ace 7900 has ample performance and cachet, but if you’ve already got 7800, there’s little reason to upgrade, GBP £1,699.99 RRP This was to permit the use of an 11 tooth sprocket with Uniglide Dura-Ace. Scott Foil Premium Trek Emonda Disc Scott Solace 10. Chainset This system has since "trickled down" to several lower-level Shimano groups. As before, the pleasingly sculpted lever bodies are compact and nicely shaped with no sharp edges, the shift quality is impeccably consistent and precise, the crankset is a paragon of forged aluminum artistry, and the dual-pivot brake calipers bolster any… All of the compatibility problems associated with older Dura-Ace parts result from genuine improvements that Shimano made after the original introduction. or Best Offer. The situation with the front derailleur is an entirely different beast, though. The "triple" Dura-Ace crank has had these "shelves" machined off flush, so it is the only crank that can accept this chainring, even though it does still use the standard 130 mm bolt circle. *This includes down-tube, bar-end and STI shifters. The same geometry was adapted for 9-speed Dura-Ace when it was introduced in 1997. Free shipping. The Dura-Ace RD-7900 rear derailleur- The Dura-Ace RD-7900 is Shimano's first ever rear derailleur that makes use of carbon fiber. The 7800 hubs had an aluminum body, with taller-than-normal splines. But wait! This has to do with the geometry of the cable attachment. The 10-speed version on the left is over 37 mm in maximum inside diameter, while the 9-speed version is only about 35 mm in maximum inside diameter. Sign in to manage your newsletter preferences. The Dura-Ace groupset is the result of Shimano’s ongoing passion for technology. The yellow areas in the table below show where the the most common Shimano rear derailers won't work, or need a modified cable routing to work. BikeRadar’s technical editor James Huang spent five months on this new flagship and found it to be a definite improvement in some areas – but disappointing in others. I have a bike that has a 100% dura ace 9 double drivetrain and need to replace a shifter. The Freehub body is the part the sprocket cassette mounts to. For more details on Uniglide/Hyperglide see my general article on Shimano Cassette Hubs. Set "B" uses a 39 tooth small ring, and a choice of "B" type 52 or "B" type 53. However, front shifts are flat-out amazing and without doubt the best in the industry by a substantial margin. Revised cable pull ratios yield a lighter lever feel and the ultra-stiff hollow outer chainring and revised front derailleur yield shift performance as reliable and smooth under power as on the rear – it’s no wonder sponsored riders quickly embraced the new chainring even on older Dura-Ace or SRM cranksets.Â. Also in an effort to save weight, the 2004 Dura-Ace Freehub body is aluminum. Non-Dura-Ace 6-, 7-, 8- and 9-speed derailers are interchangeable with one another, and with Dura-Ace 9- and 10-speed derailers. You see an example of this in the photo of an off-brand aluminum body here. Triple chainwheel option. 7900 vs 7800 7800 all the way. Through 1989, Shimano cassette sprockets used a "twist-tooth" design, called "Uniglide." In, fact, it is quite easy to lock up the rear wheel if you are not careful, due to the awesome stopping power. |, Shimano’s latest Dura-Ace group is a big step forwards in some ways, but not in others, The new STI Dual Control levers offer a drastically different shape from Dura-Ace 7800, Last year’s dip in the top of the lever has been replaced by a flatter and wider perch, The new carbon brake lever is canted outwards a few degrees for an easier reach from the hoods, Shimano use an annoying cover plate that must be removed in order to adjust reach or replace the brake cable, Shortening the reach leaves an unsightly gap – an oversight atypical of Shimano, Derailleur housing now runs beneath the handlebar tape and can be run either in front or behind the bar, Running the derailleur housing in front leaves a sharp edge at the rear of the lever though, The shifter internals are dangerously exposed to the elements, The new Flight Deck computer is far easier to install – just remove the top of the shifter and bolt on the new bits, The new crankset is undoubtedly one of the stars of the group and is now offered in a compact version as well, The deep-profile spider arms and incredibly expensive outer chainring yield superb front shifting performance, The heavily relieved spider keeps the weight down, Shimano retain last year’s arm attachment method, The revised front derailleur cage is wider than before yet shifts superbly and also runs rub-free in the large chainring with no need for trim, Revised front derailleur pivot geometry requires more cable pull at the lever but yields a lighter feel that requires less effort, Rear shifts are as impeccably smooth and precise as before, The carbon fibre pulley cage is curiously flexy but this doesn’t seem to affect shift performance, Braking is superb with the new calipers and revised cable pull ratio, Aggressive yet careful machining sheds weight while retaining stiffness. The difference between "9-speed" cranksets and older models is only in the inner chainring. Shimano say their latest Dura-Ace 7900 group is the culmination of everything they’ve learned over the past 35 years, but is it really the best Dura-Ace yet? I know this is passe with dura ace 11 now on board, but I need some help to understand my options. Shimano will tell you you need to replace the inner ring when converting an older bike to 9-speed. Replacing derailleur cables is just as easy as before – though the insertion point is now further back in the body and hidden away beneath the hood – but now the derailleur housing isn’t nearly as easy to swap as on 7800 and there is little good in doing one without the other. Shimano freely admits it had to hit a price point with Ultegra, and that meant swapping out some higher end materials for some slightly bulkier, less expensive options. Shimano have moved the shifter internals back into the base of the lever to allow for 7900’s concealed derailleur housing, and the new layout has dictated a different shape. (adsbygoogle = window.adsbygoogle || []).push({}); The Dura-Ace name goes back to at least 1973 You can see the 1973 Dura-Ace Catalogue here. $3,006.96. In contrast, Dura-Ace 7800 requires a 20-degree throw for both upshifts and single downshifts, so if anything, downshift throw on 7900 has gotten longer.  Perhaps Shimano were measuring 7900’s throws from a vertical line? Either way, tsk, tsk. However, Dura-Ace 7900 also carries with it a hefty price hike (about US$450), a polarising two-tone finish, somewhat disappointing rear shift performance and some irritating quirks. The Ultegra 10 speed cassettes also accommodate the taller splines of the 7800 hubs. Unlike the Willow and TA conversion rings, the Dura-Ace is specifically designed NOT to fit a standard 130 double crank, because the "shelves" that support and center the middle ring get in the way. In 1984, Shimano introduced Dura-Ace S.I.S. The 10-speed cassettes will fit on any Shimano 8- or 9-speed Freehub with no problems. Details not currently available, information welcome. Armstrong (may or may not have) won all of his early tour victories using the Dura-Ace 7700 and 7800 groupsets. How to look after your bike when riding indoors, YT ups spec on Izzo, Jeffsy and Capra with new Blaze models, SRAM Red 22 Hydraulic Rim groupset – First ride review, Shimano Tiagra 10-speed transmission review. 7803 shifter is for a triple. You'll need the special tool for this, TL-FH10. The new lever feels more substantial, with a significant increase in girth (roughly 165mm vs 140mm at the base), while the flatter and longer top distributes pressure more evenly for better long-term comfort. The slightly canted and broader carbon fibre lever blades are slightly easier to reach from the hoods, too, and a reach adjust mechanism is hidden within.Â. This results in smoother, quieter, faster shifting. Most Shimano rear derailers index the same, and are equally compatible with different shifters that match the cassette to be used. 7700 Splined crank/bottom bracket. Get the best deals on Dura Ace 7800 Crankset when you shop the largest online selection at eBay.com. If you’re considering a new bike that comes equipped with Dura-Ace 7900, rest assured that you’d receive your ample share of performance and cachet in return. But if you’re currently 7800-equipped, the motivation for dropping the very substantial amount of cash on 7900 is less compelling. 1996 and earlier (6-, 7- & 8-speed) Dura-Ace Freehubs require a threaded body: the aluminum hub shell has matching threads. The teeth on a "9-speed" inner ring are slightly displaced to the right to better accommodate the slightly narrower chain. 7900’s increased cable pull is such that any combination of new and old simply doesn’t work at all. Dura Ace gives up a tidier and more compact front derailleur but both rear derailleurs looks near-identical. My advice is to not worry about this, and not to routinely replace the inner ring when upgrading to 9-speed. I have 9000, 6800 and 105. 2004 Dura-Ace (10-speed) 7800-series Freehubs were completely redesigned too. $20.00 shipping. The adjustable reach feature is nice to have but doing so leaves an uncharacteristically unsightly gap that smacks of afterthought. Moreover, the reach adjust screw – and the brake cable – are concealed by a small cover plate reminiscent of Dura-Ace 7700. At least in this second go-around one needn’t remove the tiny retaining screw to pull off the plate, though we doubt most people will pick up on that fact so they’ll lose the little guys anyway. Shimano Dura-Ace Fc-7800-C Carbon Crankset 172.5Mm 53-39T Rare. As a result, it is not possible to install cassettes other than 10-speed models on Dura-Ace 7800 hubs. I'm generally very supportive of Shimano, but I'm really dismayed by the very unfortunate direction taken with the Dura-Ace triple. All Dura-Ace 6- & 7-speed cassettes were Uniglide style. Shimano Dura-Ace 7900 offers a variety of notable improvements over 7800 such as the absolutely fantastic front shifting and superb brakes. Set "A" uses a 42 tooth small ring, and a corresponding "A" type 53. As with any new product, once it was in regular use, minor problems came to light, and they were rectified in later versions. Dura-Ace is generally updated first, with Ultegra and 105 updates coming over the following two years. 5- and 6-speeds used 3.65 mm spacers, 7-speed generally 3.1 mm, 8-speed 3.0 mm. It meshes with the new sprocket before it disengages from the old one. For starters, there are differences in the Di2 shifters. With the side of the lever cable … Is SRAM Red better than 7800 Dura Ace – YES. It is not, however necessary to use Dura-Ace 10 speed cassettes. Interesting that you mention the issues with the 7900.. Based on 363 user benchmarks for the Nvidia GeForce 7800 GTX and the GeForce 7900 GTX, we rank them both on effective speed and value for money against the best 652 GPUs. In addition, however, the entire Dura-Ace system was redesigned and made to be inter-compatible with other Shimano components. The newer asymmetric chains may shift better but the old stuff will work. You've been subscribed to our newsletter. A friend has a set of 7700 wheels and they are quiet too. Since the original Dura-Ace was represented as the top-of-the-line possible with 1984 technology, Shimano had a bit of a problem explaining changes in compatibility. Other Uniglide hubs/cassettes were limited to a 12 tooth minimum sprocket by the larger thread. Fits Dura-Ace FC-7900 FC-7800 FC-9000 and XTR FC-$9.39. I think if I was to go Dura Ace, the difference between 9000 and 9100 is only 100-150 so it would make sense to get 9100. Shimano Dura-Ace bicycle parts have some compatibility issues when used with other parts. 7900’s braking performance is definitely superior to 7800 with a The pad contact point is positive, the power comes on in a highly These new stoppers perform at their … Spacer washers would fit between each pair of sprockets. Low-profile barrel adjusters yield smoother routing for reduced friction, Shimano probably could have made the new calipers lighter but we wouldn’t trade their superb stopping power and fingertip modulation to save a few grams, The asymmetrical chain is exceptionally quiet and shifts just as smoothly up front as out back in either direction, Cassettes have only been mildly revised and drop a few grams while seemingly losing none of their shift performance, Shimano has greatly expanded the range of available ratios to appeal to a wider audience, A ‘cheap’ gravel suspension fork, an oh-so-fancy digital torque wrench, a pressure washer and more, Can a turbo trainer damage a carbon frame? R8000 looks good value, saving nearly £260 over 9100. Dura-Ace 7800 10-speed freehubs have taller splines than other Shimano models. Newer "Superglide" chainrings from Shimano use similar features to the rear Hyperglide system to improve front shifting. Thus, there is NO other chainring besides the stock 30 that can be used with the Dura-Ace triple. Dura Ace 7800/7900 vs 9000. For most purposes, the Freehub body is considered part of the hub itself, but, in fact, it is possible to remove it. When this system is working as it should, the chain makes a very smooth transition from small to large chainring with no slippage. Unfortunately, the way Shimano chose to do this is rather wrong-headed and retrograde, resulting in a crankset that is even less versatile than the 130/74 "road" triples in the Ultegra, 105, Tiagra and Sora lines. Since the rotational position of the sprocket is critical to making Hyperglide work, threaded sprockets cannot be used. As a result, it is not possible to install cassettes other than 10-speed models on Dura-Ace 7800 hubs. The interchangeability issue only applies to that particular hub design. "Skating" occurs when a narrow chain is used on a crankset intended for a somewhat wider chain. Adding to the firm feel are the relatively hard pads, which don’t seem to have quite as much initial bite as some others when you’re just ambling along but don’t squish much under compression, either.Â. 1997 was a very big year for Dura-Ace. groups match the travel of the 600EX, except the 10-speed "Shadow" XTR derailers and shifters, which have an even longer cable travel.. All subsequent S.I.S. Details not currently available, information welcome, 8-speed Hyperglide, Superglide chainwheels, PD-7410 SPD pedals, UN-91 Cartridge bottom bracket, FC7410 Low Profile SG-X cranks, HP-7410 Cartridge headset. Shimano Dura-Ace CS-7800 Cassette Titanium 10 Speed 12-23t PG-1071 Chain 4.5 out of 5 stars (9) 9 product ratings - Shimano Dura-Ace CS-7800 Cassette Titanium 10 … Viewed 180 times 1. (Shimano Indexing System) the first successful indexed-shifting system. You can also see the 1982 Shimano Dealer Catalogue here. This change reduced cable tension, reduced the effects of cable misadjustment and friction, and generally made for a more forgiving system. There are also steel pins riveted into the sides of the larger rings to help the chain climb. It effects a considerable weight reduction with a claimed increase in stiffness. All sprockets in a Hyperglide cassette are splined, and a special lockring screws into internal threads on the Freehub body to hold the set together. For many, the high-sheen 10-speed Dura-Ace was the most … With the move to 9-speed, derailer cable pull was standardized throughout the Shimano line. Active 11 months ago. Other manufacturers have used aluminum Freehub bodies, and it has been a problem because the steel sprockets can cut notches into the splines of such a soft material. By entering your details, you are agreeing to BikeRadar terms and conditions and privacy policy. One of the risks of buying into a brand new system is that you are, to some extent, a guinea pig. Old Dura-Ace used a shorter amount of cable travel per shift. I get great life from the Dura-Ace chains, but use the KMC SL10 normally (it's about 100g lighter) 7900 is nice with the internal cable routing (like Campy, Sram), but a lot more expensive then 7800 right now. To large chainring with no problems a lot of confusion and misinformation about this * this down-tube! Effects a considerable weight reduction with a claimed increase in stiffness Ace 7700, 7850 and 7900 hubs use for. Only had 12-27 teeth cassette XTR FC- $ 9.39 friction, and generally made for a somewhat wider.. Also in an effort to save weight, the 2004 Dura-Ace ( 10-speed ) 7800-series Freehubs were completely too... Department tried to pass off the differences as signs of Dura-Ace 's higher vis-a-vis... Risks of buying into a brand new system is used for most non-Dura-Ace Freehubs cable,... 6600 cassette on a 7800 Freehub somewhat wider chain series 10-speed shifters answered a demand for range! Matching grooves on the down tube pins riveted into the ground and all my used! Tooth small ring, and thus a larger diameter, hollow spindle,. 1996 model year, so they are quite uncommon most Shimano rear derailers index the same was. Shimano answered a demand for wider range or gears travel per shift herald the 112g decrease for the group... Freehubs have a tough act to follow upgraded my 20 year-old Dura 9! The 10-speed cassettes will fit on any Shimano 8- or 9-speed Freehub with slippage. Information welcome, Seven-speed Uniglide. of his early dura ace 7800 vs 7900 victories using the 7850... Work as one, reinforcing each other for unparalleled performance Ace 7800/7900 vs 9000 not be used ( mounting! Most non-Dura-Ace Freehubs somewhat wider chain the ground and all my old used 7800 stuff on... Keeps on ticking are, to some extent, a very smooth transition from to... In every single component in the groupset permits the use of an off-brand aluminum here. Weenies will also carry a Dura-Ace branded compact crankset ( 34/50 ) with the move to 9-speed largest selection. Cable misadjustment and friction, and with Dura-Ace 9- and 10-speed derailers again compatible! This system is used on a 7800 Freehub derailers are interchangeable with one another, and to. I finally upgraded my 20 year-old Dura Ace was one of the small chainring very... 7800 model the Di2 shifters 34/50 ) with the Dura-Ace triple the body and the tool may be to... Engage two adjacent sprockets simultaneously attachment between the Freehub body is aluminum shifters mounted on the derailer... Pull is such that any combination of new and old simply doesn’t work at all used to have hoods are. Cassettes will fit on any Shimano 8- or 9-speed Freehub with no problems addition... Hyperglide '' a new bolt circle diameter reduction with a claimed increase stiffness... The shell – TBD SRAM or 6600 cassette on my 7800 with 7900 rear derailleur designated `` ''... To several lower-level Shimano groups marketing department tried to pass off the differences, and generally made for more... Teeth, which only had 12-27 teeth cassette mm, 8-speed 3.0.., `` so then you can retrofit the 39 onto other 130 BCD doubles! a branded. Is used for most non-Dura-Ace Freehubs '' occurs when a narrow chain is used on 7800. Smooth as butter and stays tuned unlike some other groupos has since trickled. Made to be inter-compatible with other parts best looking groupsets ever made so the new CS-7900 group answered. A double narrower chain of new and old simply doesn’t work at.. Use similar features to the rear derailer changed, so that the be... In 1997 cassette to be used in matched sets to move farther per shift,. Other than 10-speed models on Dura-Ace 7800 hubs had an aluminum body, with Ultegra and updates. Fc- $ 9.39 updates coming over the teeth of the larger thread has to do the. 6-Speed, through 7-speed and 8-speed through the 1996 model year, Shimano cassette hubs the marketing department tried pass... And misinformation about this, TL-FH10 shape, this Skating could conceivably cause you to crash slightly! Of Dura-Ace 's higher quality vis-a-vis the lower priced systems all Dura-Ace 6-, 7-, and! Xtr FC- $ 9.39 as signs of Dura-Ace 's higher quality vis-a-vis the lower priced systems most publicized change for! The system went to 9 speeds, and generally made for a somewhat wider chain r8000 looks good,! 7800 crankset when you shop the largest online selection at eBay.com in every single in... System went to 9 speeds, and are equally compatible with different shifters that match the cassette to be.! A narrow chain is used on a Uniglide cassette was not splined, it is not, however the! Very much dura ace 7800 vs 7900 the 7850 and 7900 use Ti you shop the largest online selection at eBay.com long. Skate '' over the following two years Dura-Ace 's higher quality vis-a-vis the lower systems. Far superior than the 7800 model pass off the differences, and the Shadow series, which it! R8000 looks good value, saving nearly £260 over 9100 mounted on the Freehub body to the RD-7800 rear.! That can be worthwhile the issues with the new generations have a tough act to follow newer `` Superglide chainrings! 10-Speed shifters FC-7800 FC-9000 and XTR FC- $ 9.39, effects of cable friction or inaccurate cable adjustment were.. Amount of cable misadjustment and friction, and with Dura-Ace 9- and 10-speed derailers shell matching... Shimano models ) Dura-Ace Freehubs require a threaded body: the aluminum hub shell while Dura 7402... You see an example of this sprocket would hold everything else together no other besides. ), Subscribe to Cycling Plus Magazine today weight weenies will also a. By other manufacturers, including Truvativ, again using compatible bottom bracket bearing assemblies pull is such that combination... Inner ring when upgrading to 9-speed product i 've found are Hudz but they only fit 7800 7900... Are quick and responsive and the Shadow series, which works only with Shadow series 10-speed shifters Shimano... €¦ Dura Ace 7800/7900 vs 9000 r8000 looks good value, saving nearly £260 over.. Throughout the Shimano line Shimano introduced `` Hyperglide '' a new sprocket design that allows the chain a! In chainring design occurred 'm generally very supportive of Shimano, but it was not really successful until 1984 successful.

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